Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: They're driven, they're high achievers. They. They're, you know, they're out there, like, winning at their careers or making an impact in the world. Like, they're good friends, they're good partners, they're good parents, and so they want to do well. And that is admirable and a wonderful quality. And if you set the bar so high that it's unachievable, you're never going to even show up for it, because then it just becomes really an impossible thing. So, for example,
[00:00:32] Speaker B: we just recorded an entire conversation and I forgot to hit record.
It's gone forever.
And it made me think, how many people have a book like that, thought about it, talked about it, but never actually got it out into the world.
This episode with Stacey Ennis is about to suck.
So I'm here with Stacy, and she's worked on over 100 books, and she says something that stopped me in my tracks.
She said, it's not talent that holds people back from writing their book, it's structure.
Enjoy my chat with Stacey Ennis.
It's the same red blinking.in rec.
[00:01:26] Speaker A: It looks exactly the same. You are 100% right.
[00:01:30] Speaker B: I am once again here with Stacey Ennis, and not only because we talked three years ago, but we also talked, like, 33 minutes ago, and we did not hit record. So thank you so much for coming back and recording this again.
[00:01:47] Speaker A: It's my pleasure.
It's sad because we said the most brilliant things that have ever been said in the world, and now nobody will hear it.
[00:01:56] Speaker B: So it's going to start again forever.
Just like the potential book that was the best ever, that was never written.
I know. Okay, I'm being. I'm being cheesy, but that's kind of what we were talking about. We were talking about how what blocks a lot of people from writing their book is this idea of this, like, fantastical, best thing of all time ever in existence, in the history of time, that because it's so great, you put all this pressure on yourself and, like, in my case, I just didn't write it because I thought, oh, if I don't start, then I can't fail.
So, like, you, can you tell us about your program that's in the coming six months that will solve all of these issues and we'll just make the world a better place.
[00:02:42] Speaker A: Well, I. First of all, I love that you mentioned that you. You had all of these years of, like, your bar was so high for writing the best book that it just stopped you from ever starting. And What I find with a lot of the authors that I work with, they're driven, they're high achievers, they, they're, you know, they're out there like winning at their careers or making an impact on the world. Like they're good friends, they're good partners, they're good parents. And so they want to do well. And that is admirable and a wonderful quality. And if you set the bar so high that it's unachievable, you're never going to even show up for it because then it just becomes really an impossible thing. So for example, I have a lot of authors that either they either believe they need to have two solid hours at least every day to write, which is lovely and I've definitely gone through periods of that and it's amazing, but it's unrealistic for most people. They think they need to get away for like a month alone to write their books, which we all know, especially for parents, like that's not gonna happen in any time, anytime in the near future.
And so they set these goals for themselves or this ideal that keeps them from showing up for 15 minutes. And if you show up for 15 minutes every day, that's way better than zero minutes. And showing up actually 15, 30, 45 minutes, an hour, that can make a lot of progress in over time.
So I'm often inviting authors to lower the bar for success.
And I know you asked about my program, so maybe I'll just start really high level and then you can drill into what you are curious about. So the program is a six month program and it takes authors from idea to first draft and also helps them understand and get connected to the right next steps for their author journey. So at the end of the program, what they can expect to have completed along with going through a transformative author journey, along with understanding their messaging, their story better, creating frameworks, or at least putting a container around their frameworks and really showing up with more confidence and clarity. So all that happens. But then the bonus to that is they have around a 50,000 word book draft that they're give or take, you know, people either. Some authors tend to write a lot, some write a little less with their first draft that's ready to now move into editing, publishing and marketing. So that's really what they create. And, and it's not just any old book. So I don't work with authors that the book is it for them. I love authors that write with the book being it. I read their books, I enjoy them. But for me I work with leaders who are creating books that are catalyst for something they want to do in the world. So grow their business, brand, work with a lot of social impact makers, a lot of nonprofit leaders, a lot of people that are in retirement or they've exited a company and they're like, oh, now what? Like, how can I live into my purpose now?
[00:05:54] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:05:55] Speaker A: So that book is part of their catalyst into their next thing and making the impact that they're meant to make on the world.
[00:06:03] Speaker B: Well, speaking of making the book, not it like the one and only it, the thing, the big thing, the only thing that also reduces the, the pressure.
[00:06:13] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:06:13] Speaker B: Because then if they have these other things and book is one element of it, then it's not the only element. And. Oh, and if the, and if the what is book, you know, on that note, what does a book success look like then in your world, like with your clients, what does success look like? Because I know a lot of people, it's like, oh, sell this number of copies, but that's not ne. That's not your game necessarily, the number of copies sold. So what does success look like for. For an author in your, your world?
[00:06:47] Speaker A: Yeah, I love that you brought that up because I think it's easy math for authors to go, okay, if I sell X copies, I'll make back. It'll be worth it. It'll make back my investment. I'll do this, I'll do, you know, I'll feel this way.
But actually positioning a book for book sales and a positioning a book for impact are not often the same thing thing.
So if you are optimizing for sales, you are studying the market, you're making sure that it's fitting, like in this certain genre with these certain type of titles, that it's kind of COVID to cover with them that it would sell in these categories.
When you're positioning for impact, you might look at some of that, but you're more interested in how this will be a tool to help you achieve your impact in the world. And that also means that you're not necessarily worried so much about some of the traditional marketing things like maybe running Amazon ads, although a lot of my clients do do that.
But you're using it as a door opener, a client generator to accompany a keynote speech that maybe you haven't done yet, but you want to do.
And so success, I think, is a few things. I think one is you've achieved often a lifelong goal, or maybe it's something you've held the last few years.
You create a book that is the best book that you can create with the time that you have, the skills that you have and the resources you have access to.
And then you've shown up for that launch. Because what I sometimes see authors do is they start to retract when their book or contract, retract, whatever, when their book starts to, like, when it's being launched. And so rather than showing up with confidence and fullness and celebration and inviting people into this experience with you and, like, really celebrating and marketing, they just kind of think that the world will find them, and that just is not how it happens.
Interestingly, just a minute ago, before I logged on to talk to you for the second time. Yeah, for the second time. So in between, I was like, we got off. I checked some emails and.
And then I went over. I always check social every day just to see what's going on with my clients, see how I can amplify them, comment on their things, share their stuff.
And so I went on Instagram and I saw that one of my clients had a huge feature in the Wall Street Journal.
[00:09:15] Speaker B: Wow.
[00:09:17] Speaker A: Yeah, I know. And I think her book's now, I want to say it's like two years. It's been two years since it came out, which I think is a really.
[00:09:26] Speaker B: Oh, wow.
[00:09:26] Speaker A: Testament to creating great work. Because, yeah, she's got. They came and they took photos of her. She's like, it's so cool. And this is Regina Lawless, by the way. She's amazing person, amazing author. Her book is called do you.
And yeah, I think, like, part of the reason that she's achieved things like that is because she's put in the work. She wrote a great book. She did a great job with the editorial. She worked with a really quality publisher. It's beautiful. It's got, like an embossed.
Like a jacket with beautiful embossed letters. Like, it really is an incredible book and the quality is great. And then she's shown up for its marketing, and it's like the life cycle of it. And so success doesn't end with that first draft. It really is a journey. But if you create a book for service, like, it's meant to serve the world in some way, uplift the world in some way, that book will be sustainable. Like, it's not going to die after a year. It's not going to stop having an impact.
[00:10:38] Speaker B: I think that's such a big difference, especially because, as you know, I'm so much. Have my foot in the.
Not that this is my world that I do this, but especially, like, And I'm sorry in advance to fiction romance writers. But fiction romance writers, they like go crank out a book a month.
[00:10:57] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:10:57] Speaker B: And. And so. And they're. And they're hungry readers who want just that they're hungry readers want a book a month and that's fine. And it's fine for that romance author who's going to write a book a month and the romance reader who wants to read a book a month. That's great. But when you just said the Wall Street Journal two years later, not they just had the big launch party and it's in all fresh and pretty and honeymoon phase. Nope. Two years down the road. But that's like eternity and it is sort of the short term world. So that is really a good sign that it's really a quality, you know, creation.
[00:11:34] Speaker A: I hope I have the timeline right, but I know it's been a while, so it's somewhere in that, in that realm and.
But yeah, it is. It's been a while. It's not a fresh launch. It's not right. You know, brand new.
Yeah. It's incredible.
And I think there's space for all of it.
I have a friend back in my hometown that she would write for four to six hours at a time and she loved it and she would write so many books. And I think there's space for all different types of books and authors. For me, I've just found my lane, which is I like working with leaders. I. I work with people that they want to put good into the world. They want to live into their purpose, they want to create great a great book. They don't want to just write junk and get junk to market. They don't want to write a business card book. I don't personally.
Why, why would you even write one? Like just do, do your best work.
[00:12:35] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:12:36] Speaker A: And I like to work with people that they want to always do their best and serve in the best way and they know what they don't know. So they are humble enough to go, I've never written a book before. I could struggle for another three years. Or I could work with an expert that has a process that will hold my hand, that will make it fun, that is smart and a good thought partner and super connected and will make sure that I'm like that. I'm kind of wrapped in support as I'm creating this important thing.
[00:13:18] Speaker B: Yeah.
You know, you said a minute ago something like, this is the best book that you, who you are right now, can write right now.
And I really like that. Also thinking of this, the idea of the six months and then like the 18 months for the whole thing. But the book you, you know, dear, dear author or potential author, watching or listening.
I think the book you write right now is so different from the one that might come in a year or five years.
Yes, that's. And that's why also. And then, hello, bonus surprise element.
The book you write right now. Good. And get that done and make that be the greatest thing of all time or right now. And then you know what? Surprise, surprise, you can write another one in X amount of time when that book is ready for its, its time in the, in the spotlight. And I think that's especially what I suffered from. I thought I would have one book forever in my whole life and it's going to be the greatest thing of all time. So that's why I didn't do it, because it was just going to be this one, be all, end all. And I didn't even think of other books. I just thought, no, no, no, it's just going to be that one.
And so that's why I can wait.
Whereas I finally got it done and then it was just like the dam broke and I thought, oh, wait, there's. I can write more. What?
So I really like that you say, because that's what I'm thinking of. Hey, it's March. You know, you're starting in April, you'll be done in October, and then you'll, you'll have this in your hand by October. That's this.
[00:15:01] Speaker A: I like what you're saying because I, I see such relief in the authors that I speak with when I, you know, usually when I get on a call with a potential author, they either have no idea, like they're like, well, I've done all these things and these are what I things I care about. So I think it could be about this or maybe this or maybe that, or the author has. Often it's two ideas. One is a very personal idea, so it's connected to something that they overcame or an experience that they had or their career trajectory or something like that. And then there's one that's business oriented. So it's their expertise, their kind of system, whatever it is, they want to write about that. And so when I explain how my process works, I can see just so much relief because what I help them do is first I help them take everything and just get it out. And then I help them sort through it and find patterns. And what happens is we normally come up with several different ideas for books and then what we're doing from there is sequencing those books. So what we're looking for is, okay, Bradley's here, and your big vision is this. You know that you're at point A and you want to get to point B.
And so we have five books. And if we look at these five books, that you're ideating this one book, first of all, visually, because we build this out in a tactile way, has more. It's more robust. We can just see there's more energy there. Okay, so let's thought experiment this. We'll put this here. And so what we're trying to do is just uncover that right book for right now and be open to and acknowledge that there probably are more books to come. And that's okay if there aren't. But what we don't want to do is we don't want to put everything on this one project, also knowing that we evolve and change over time and we'll have more to offer. But also, to your earlier point, one of the things that often holds authors back is they're like, well, I should write this book in five years when I have more, whatever.
And I always think that's really unfortunate because a lot of times where you are is much more valuable to the person that's a few steps behind you. A lot of authors are really writing to themselves, like, five, ten years ago. That's their target reader.
And so if you wait five years or more, let's say you're that much more disconnected from your reader's current experience, and you kind of forget some of the things that are really on your mind and heart right now.
And I've worked with such a huge range of ages with authors I've. Like, right now I'm working with an author in her 20s.
I just finished working with an author in his 70s.
And everywhere across the spectrum and every age and every stage has so much value. It's really about figuring out what is my. What is my unique angle and story that I bring to this and who is my reader, and making sure that you're creating something for that reader and that it is positioned for that big vision that you have. And it maybe sounds more com.
It probably sounds a little complicated as I'm explaining it, but actually, really what you need to do, I have a system to help you think through this. And then you have to put in the thinking time. Like, that's the hard part really is just, you know, clearing the cobwebs of your brain, getting it out and.
And introspecting which is becoming a lost art, actually, I think. Or has already become.
Has already become a lost art. So sometimes I'm guiding people back to their own thoughts and helping them reconnect with their own thinking in a way that they've never done before, which is so cool.
[00:19:04] Speaker B: Wow.
Oh, the idea of this book for you now, and I just think like you say the 20 year old and the 70 year old and they have the book that's for them now.
[00:19:16] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:19:17] Speaker B: And they can have another one later. But you know, to completely use our. My mistake of not hitting enough record buttons because for the record, Stacey and I were just on a zoom call call for. It must have been at least an hour and there was a blinking record button up there. So let's. If I. If I turn that story into what if that recording were the book that I thought out and thought about and talked about for an hour, but I never wrote or never published, and it's. It's gone forever. And so I kind of see this as, again, I'm kind of going on the same idea of this is the book for you right now.
And that hour of time we spent an hour ago, it's. It's gone.
And if you don't. I don't. I don't want to. I don't like being threatening, but I can pretend I'm talking to myself. If I don't write the book that I need to write for me now, that's the best book that I can write this year.
The next year, it's not the same book. I'm a different person next year.
[00:20:30] Speaker A: And you've missed out, I think, on a lot of the opportunity that the journey of that will bring you. And then the nice bonus at the end is having this stat. It's really a status elevation for a lot of authors is like pitching events, client leads, social impact. So many of my clients are in the social impact space.
Yeah, you're right. And then it's.
It's not there. It can't be the same.
Yeah, I love, I love that you just pinpointed that. I don't think I've ever really thought about it that way before.
[00:21:06] Speaker B: Yeah.
You know, another thing I like about your program is it, it has a deadline, and you also have a deadline in five minutes. I want to respect that. And I, the, the reason I'm mentioning it is because, so I have this graphic of a calendar and then I have a. A note. You know how a calendar says, like, Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, Friday, Saturday, Sunday? Right. They have dates, and those are the names of those days.
So I have, like, this fake fantasmical calendar that has a day, and the day is called Someday.
Like S O M E. Right, Someday. Which of course, the joke and the harsh, sad, brutal reality of that is that that calendar doesn't exist. Because Someday doesn't exist.
Because that used to be when I was going to write that book. Oh, yes, Someday. So I had the calendar that says Someday, that's the day, but it doesn't exist. And that's the scary part. So that's why I like, your program is six months. So in October of this year.
[00:22:03] Speaker A: Right.
[00:22:03] Speaker B: If you join in April, and then it's October, the fourth month, this tenth month, that's six months.
After that time, you will have a draft that's so tangible.
And I love that.
[00:22:16] Speaker A: Yeah, I like the tangibility of it, too, of having a container, because it's really. I mean, creativity thrives within a container.
It's really tough if you have no boundaries, no containers around your creative work. Because what often happens is authors will kind of dilly dally in their writing process for years. And then over time, to your point, you evolve, you change. The book kind of loses its cohesion, then you have to rewrite, and then it's like, what's the point? And, you know, having that container is really important. Deadlines are magic for creative work. Yeah.
[00:23:01] Speaker B: I had a subway ride when I was first getting started writing. Subway is 23 minutes long. I knew it. I sat down. Boom. No messing around, no social media, no nothing. It was. Get down to it, because I had 23.3min go.
It was the most efficient and effective time I ever had. Even if I had a full free day of 24 hours, I can do whatever I want. I didn't get as much done when I only had that constraint of the 23 minutes.
[00:23:25] Speaker A: I love that. I think that is so powerful because, again, you know, that was. That was a space that you like. You said, I didn't do social. I didn't do any of that.
You know, I really cannot stand when people say everybody has the same 24 hours in a day. Because it's not true.
Single moms. I think also people in underrepresented groups, they have different realities that more privileged people don't have to experience. Or disabled child. You're caring for a parent.
And we all have a choice.
We all have choice. It might vary how much space we have to choose, but we all have choice. And. And you chose in 23 minutes to use that and we all have pockets of choice.
And also if we are always waiting for tons and tons of choice, then maybe the book will never get written. So you gotta make the decision, if it matters to you, to do it and make the space. It's only six months. It's not five years. I'm not asking you to do a bachelor's degree. It's like a graduate level course is kind of how I would think about it. For six months.
[00:24:39] Speaker B: Yeah, you said maybe the book will never get written. I think I would say it more harshly. The book will never get.
[00:24:45] Speaker A: Will not.
Yes, we know that to be true.
[00:24:49] Speaker B: Yeah, we know that to be true. Okay. Speaking of deadlines, I know you have to go. Thank you so much again for your time and Stacy's program, it starts in April and it ends in October. And in October you have in your hands a draft. And that right there is reason enough. And all the other procrastination, all the other stuff that's in the way. It's 23 minutes on the subway.
And if I do it, you know, if I can do that on a subway, then you can do it too. Okay, thanks, Stacey.
[00:25:17] Speaker A: Bradley, thanks for letting me share in your space and thanks for all the great work that you do. Inspiring writers.
[00:25:25] Speaker B: Yeah. And thanks for what you're doing. And let's talk again and we'll hit record again.
[00:25:31] Speaker A: Okay, sounds great.
[00:25:32] Speaker B: Sometime in the future. And talking more about the status because we talked a lot about like the status. Status of the industry and stuff and that was really cool. So we'll have to catch up again soon.
[00:25:41] Speaker A: I love that idea. I think that could also be really interesting for anybody, all of your subscribers, because, man, things are changing.
[00:25:49] Speaker B: A lot going on. Yeah.
And be human and tell your story and get it out there.
[00:25:55] Speaker A: Be human. I love that. Yes. That's a great note to end on.
Thanks, Bradley, least so much.
[00:26:00] Speaker B: Thanks, Stacey. All right, thanks to you. Bye.
[00:26:03] Speaker A: Bye.
